Need help to Clone a Drive. As a backup, please help??

Crackles McFarly wrote:
> I have partitioned my drive into two sections. One very large section
> and another much smaller one.
>
> The smallest partition is 3x [three times] the size of the OS and
> every currently on the drive. In other words, the smaller partition is
> more than big enough to accept the data.
>
> Question:
> Can I CLONE the main drive on to the other partition?
>
> It is assigned drive letter Z, so would this work or am I just plain
> crazy?
>
> thanks.

Yes you can, but why would you want to? If the drive fails you lose the main
o/s and the backup. SO yes, you are crazy.

SteveH
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On Thu, 12 Jul 2007 01:48:35 -0400, Crackles McFarly
<IrelandSux.RemoveThis@ireland.sux> wrote:

>I have partitioned my drive into two sections. One very large section
>and another much smaller one.
>
>The smallest partition is 3x [three times] the size of the OS and
>every currently on the drive. In other words, the smaller partition is
>more than big enough to accept the data.
>
>Question:
>Can I CLONE the main drive on to the other partition?
>
>It is assigned drive letter Z, so would this work or am I just plain
>crazy?
>
If it's just for backup purposes then a clone would be a waste of a
partition ( what you referred to as a 'section' ) - you'd just end up
with two identical partitions. Not much use unless you're going to
dual boot.

The standard practice is to back up a partition to an 'image file'.
This is essentially a compressed 'snapshot' of a partition, and can be
stored almost anywhere ( on a completely separate hard drive is the
best idea ) as a file.

There are plenty of decent programs that can do this...such as Norton
Ghost, Paragon Drive Backup, Acronis TrueImage etc. - some of which
pop up as freebies on computer mag cover discs.

But in answer to your question, yes - IF you are able to specify that
you want to resize the copy when cloning from a large partition to a
smaller one.

Regards,



--
Stephen Howard - Woodwind repairs & period restorations
www.shwoodwind.co.uk
Emails to: showard{whoisat}shwoodwind{dot}co{dot}uk
 >> Stay informed about: Need help to Clone a Drive. As a backup, please help?? 

Stephen Howard wrote:
> On Thu, 12 Jul 2007 01:48:35 -0400, Crackles McFarly
> <IrelandSux RemoveThis @ireland.sux> wrote:
>
>> I have partitioned my drive into two sections. One very large section
>> and another much smaller one.
>>
>> The smallest partition is 3x [three times] the size of the OS and
>> every currently on the drive. In other words, the smaller partition is
>> more than big enough to accept the data.
>>
>> Question:
>> Can I CLONE the main drive on to the other partition?
>>
>> It is assigned drive letter Z, so would this work or am I just plain
>> crazy?
>>
> If it's just for backup purposes then a clone would be a waste of a
> partition ( what you referred to as a 'section' ) - you'd just end up
> with two identical partitions. Not much use unless you're going to
> dual boot.
>
> The standard practice is to back up a partition to an 'image file'.
> This is essentially a compressed 'snapshot' of a partition, and can be
> stored almost anywhere ( on a completely separate hard drive is the
> best idea ) as a file.
>
> There are plenty of decent programs that can do this...such as Norton
> Ghost, Paragon Drive Backup, Acronis TrueImage etc. - some of which
> pop up as freebies on computer mag cover discs.
>
> But in answer to your question, yes - IF you are able to specify that
> you want to resize the copy when cloning from a large partition to a
> smaller one.
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
My suggestion is to get a second disk and put your system backups on it.
Recent experience; For some reason the partition table of my "C" drive
was damaged making it inaccessible. Good thing I had an Acronis backup
of my "C" drive stored in a partition of my second drive. Recovery was
a snap.

Some backup and restore programs allow you to place backups on CD or
DVD, and even on USB disk drives.
 >> Stay informed about: Need help to Clone a Drive. As a backup, please help?? 

On Thu, 12 Jul 2007 02:29:13 -0400, kony <spam.DeleteThis@spam.com> sayd the
following:

>On Thu, 12 Jul 2007 01:48:35 -0400, Crackles McFarly
><IrelandSux.DeleteThis@ireland.sux> wrote:
>
>>I have partitioned my drive into two sections. One very large section
>>and another much smaller one.
>>
>>The smallest partition is 3x [three times] the size of the OS and
>>every currently on the drive. In other words, the smaller partition is
>>more than big enough to accept the data.
>>
>>Question:
>>Can I CLONE the main drive on to the other partition?
>>
>>It is assigned drive letter Z, so would this work or am I just plain
>>crazy?
>>
>>thanks.
>
>Be a bit more clear about exactly what you're trying to do.
>
>In short, yes if the destination is larger than the source
>you can clone it.

Have a c and z drive. c is main partition on drive, z is a smaller
partition but still 3x the size of the data written to main drive c.

Want to clone drive c to drive z partition as a form of backup.

Was wondering if cloning would work since it's another partition and
not another drive.
 >> Stay informed about: Need help to Clone a Drive. As a backup, please help?? 

On Thu, 12 Jul 2007 09:01:28 GMT, "SteveH"
<steve.houghREMOVE.RemoveThis@MEblueyonder.co.uk> sayd the following:

>Crackles McFarly wrote:
>> I have partitioned my drive into two sections. One very large section
>> and another much smaller one.
>>
>> The smallest partition is 3x [three times] the size of the OS and
>> every currently on the drive. In other words, the smaller partition is
>> more than big enough to accept the data.
>>
>> Question:
>> Can I CLONE the main drive on to the other partition?
>>
>> It is assigned drive letter Z, so would this work or am I just plain
>> crazy?
>>
>> thanks.
>
>Yes you can, but why would you want to? If the drive fails you lose the main
>o/s and the backup. SO yes, you are crazy.

Well its more likely a partition might get corrupt or I might be dumb
and get a virus on main c partition. I read only and hidden the Z
drive partition.

If i'm crazy then ok.
 >> Stay informed about: Need help to Clone a Drive. As a backup, please help?? 

On Thu, 12 Jul 2007 12:35:56 +0100, Stephen Howard
<seesigfor.RemoveThis@email.uk> sayd the following:

>On Thu, 12 Jul 2007 01:48:35 -0400, Crackles McFarly
><IrelandSux.RemoveThis@ireland.sux> wrote:
>
>>I have partitioned my drive into two sections. One very large section
>>and another much smaller one.
>>
>>The smallest partition is 3x [three times] the size of the OS and
>>every currently on the drive. In other words, the smaller partition is
>>more than big enough to accept the data.
>>
>>Question:
>>Can I CLONE the main drive on to the other partition?
>>
>>It is assigned drive letter Z, so would this work or am I just plain
>>crazy?
>>
>If it's just for backup purposes then a clone would be a waste of a
>partition ( what you referred to as a 'section' ) - you'd just end up
>with two identical partitions. Not much use unless you're going to
>dual boot.
>
>The standard practice is to back up a partition to an 'image file'.
>This is essentially a compressed 'snapshot' of a partition, and can be
>stored almost anywhere ( on a completely separate hard drive is the
>best idea ) as a file.
>
>There are plenty of decent programs that can do this...such as Norton
>Ghost, Paragon Drive Backup, Acronis TrueImage etc. - some of which
>pop up as freebies on computer mag cover discs.
>
>But in answer to your question, yes - IF you are able to specify that
>you want to resize the copy when cloning from a large partition to a
>smaller one.
>
>Regards,


it's a seagate drive and they offer a download called disk wizzard.
it's suppose to clone and do images. problem is, when you attempt a
clone it tells you to go to acronis and download a discounted version
which in my opinion is still way too expensive.

was wondering this.

can i make an image of the drive on the same drive? i assume the image
of the drive is simple a large file that can be read by the program
that made the image?

how do i then copy that image file to several dvd's?
in nero for example, can i set it up to back up the image file over
several dvd's in a manner that can later be restored by either nero or
the image making program?

thanks
 >> Stay informed about: Need help to Clone a Drive. As a backup, please help?? 

On Sat, 14 Jul 2007 10:18:34 -0400, Don
<nntp.20.donald2007.DeleteThis@spamgourmet.com> sayd the following:

>Some backup and restore programs allow you to place backups on CD or
>DVD, and even on USB disk drives.


if the image i make of the current C drive where the os resides is
very large, lets sat 40gb, then how do you span that image file across
several dvd's? and then how to restore that spanned image file?
thanks
 >> Stay informed about: Need help to Clone a Drive. As a backup, please help?? 

On 2007-07-14, Crackles McFarly <IrelandSux.DeleteThis@ireland.sux> wrote:
> On Thu, 12 Jul 2007 09:01:28 GMT, "SteveH"
>>
>>Yes you can, but why would you want to? If the drive fails you lose the main
>>o/s and the backup. SO yes, you are crazy.
>
> Well its more likely a partition might get corrupt or I might be dumb
> and get a virus on main c partition. I read only and hidden the Z
> drive partition.

There are still other factors to consider. What happens if your
patition infomtaion gets corrupted and you loose both partitions?
What happens with a power surge that causes damage? What protection
have you against flood/fire/theft? A critically important factor
that is often overlooked: what happens if you suffer from any of
these events whilst you are actually taking a backup?

If this is your only backup policy you _will_ be let down by it.
It may not be for a few tears but it will happen. Robust backup
strategies have to address this kind of thing.

I used to say always have a tape drive for backup for this reason.
Nowadays it's difficult to justify. For my home network, I have
a couple of ~300Gb USB drives for backup at the moment - each is
good for a couple of complete backups and a number of personal
data-only backups. When they're not in use they live in my desk
at work - off site storage is also something to consider. I paid
less than £150 for the pair of them. I consider that a small price
to pay given how much hassle losing even "unimportant" data is.

--
Andrew Smallshaw
andrews.DeleteThis@sdf.lonestar.org
 >> Stay informed about: Need help to Clone a Drive. As a backup, please help?? 

On 2007-07-14, Crackles McFarly <IrelandSux DeleteThis @ireland.sux> wrote:
> On Thu, 12 Jul 2007 09:01:28 GMT, "SteveH"
>>
>>Yes you can, but why would you want to? If the drive fails you lose the main
>>o/s and the backup. SO yes, you are crazy.
>
> Well its more likely a partition might get corrupt or I might be dumb
> and get a virus on main c partition. I read only and hidden the Z
> drive partition.

There are still other factors to consider. What happens if your
patition infomtaion gets corrupted and you loose both partitions?
What happens with a power surge that causes damage? What protection
have you against flood/fire/theft? A critically important factor
that is often overlooked: what happens if you suffer from any of
these events whilst you are actually taking a backup?

If this is your only backup policy you _will_ be let down by it.
It may not be for a few years but it will happen. Robust backup
strategies have to address this kind of thing.

I used to say always have a tape drive for backup for this reason.
Nowadays it's difficult to justify. For my home network, I have
a couple of ~300Gb USB drives for backup at the moment - each is
good for a couple of complete backups and a number of personal
data-only backups. When they're not in use they live in my desk
at work - off site storage is also something to consider. I paid
less than £150 for the pair of them. I consider that a small price
to pay given how much hassle losing even "unimportant" data is.

--
Andrew Smallshaw
andrews DeleteThis @sdf.lonestar.org
 >> Stay informed about: Need help to Clone a Drive. As a backup, please help?? 

On 2007-07-14, Crackles McFarly <IrelandSux.TakeThisOut@ireland.sux> wrote:
> On Sat, 14 Jul 2007 10:18:34 -0400, Don
><nntp.20.donald2007.TakeThisOut@spamgourmet.com> sayd the following:
>
>>Some backup and restore programs allow you to place backups on CD or
>>DVD, and even on USB disk drives.
>
> if the image i make of the current C drive where the os resides is
> very large, lets sat 40gb, then how do you span that image file across
> several dvd's? and then how to restore that spanned image file?
> thanks

Most* backup packages will allow you to span multiple media volumes
in this way - it's simply a matter of using a proper backup package
rather than other tools not specifically designed for the job.

Whilst this is far preferable to your earlier approach, I'd advise
against it. For a start, DVD-R's aren't the most reliable media
in the world. More importantly though, backing up a disk in this
manner involves multiple DVDs. That's a lot of work. In the real
world this tends to mean that it doesn't get done.

* I was going to say _all_ backup programs, but the one I use
(Amanda) is a little long in the tooth and still doesn't have
this capability. I would think the vast majority of Windows
backup programs will do this, however.

--
Andrew Smallshaw
andrews.TakeThisOut@sdf.lonestar.org
 >> Stay informed about: Need help to Clone a Drive. As a backup, please help?? 

On Sat, 14 Jul 2007 21:07:05 +0000 (UTC), Andrew Smallshaw
<andrews RemoveThis @sdf.lonestar.org> sayd the following:

>On 2007-07-14, Crackles McFarly <IrelandSux RemoveThis @ireland.sux> wrote:
>> On Sat, 14 Jul 2007 10:18:34 -0400, Don
>><nntp.20.donald2007 RemoveThis @spamgourmet.com> sayd the following:
>>
>>>Some backup and restore programs allow you to place backups on CD or
>>>DVD, and even on USB disk drives.
>>
>> if the image i make of the current C drive where the os resides is
>> very large, lets sat 40gb, then how do you span that image file across
>> several dvd's? and then how to restore that spanned image file?
>> thanks
>
>Most* backup packages will allow you to span multiple media volumes
>in this way - it's simply a matter of using a proper backup package
>rather than other tools not specifically designed for the job.
>
>Whilst this is far preferable to your earlier approach, I'd advise
>against it. For a start, DVD-R's aren't the most reliable media
>in the world. More importantly though, backing up a disk in this
>manner involves multiple DVDs. That's a lot of work. In the real
>world this tends to mean that it doesn't get done.
>
>* I was going to say _all_ backup programs, but the one I use
> (Amanda) is a little long in the tooth and still doesn't have
> this capability. I would think the vast majority of Windows
> backup programs will do this, however.


So you'd go with BUYING an external drive instead?

I don't need a huge one for just the main bones of the OS to back up,
perhaps 20GB is it right now.

Yours Truly,
Crackles R. McFarly
Associates Degree in Air Quality and Pollen Studies
Certified Air Quality Specialist 'X7 Station: Fulton County, Georgia'
 >> Stay informed about: Need help to Clone a Drive. As a backup, please help?? 

On Sun, 15 Jul 2007 02:01:20 -0400, Crackles McFarly
<IrelandSux.RemoveThis@ireland.sux> wrote:

>On Sat, 14 Jul 2007 21:07:05 +0000 (UTC), Andrew Smallshaw
><andrews.RemoveThis@sdf.lonestar.org> sayd the following:
>
>>On 2007-07-14, Crackles McFarly <IrelandSux.RemoveThis@ireland.sux> wrote:
>>> On Sat, 14 Jul 2007 10:18:34 -0400, Don
>>><nntp.20.donald2007.RemoveThis@spamgourmet.com> sayd the following:
>>>
>>>>Some backup and restore programs allow you to place backups on CD or
>>>>DVD, and even on USB disk drives.
>>>
>>> if the image i make of the current C drive where the os resides is
>>> very large, lets sat 40gb, then how do you span that image file across
>>> several dvd's? and then how to restore that spanned image file?
>>> thanks
>>
>>Most* backup packages will allow you to span multiple media volumes
>>in this way - it's simply a matter of using a proper backup package
>>rather than other tools not specifically designed for the job.
>>
>>Whilst this is far preferable to your earlier approach, I'd advise
>>against it. For a start, DVD-R's aren't the most reliable media
>>in the world. More importantly though, backing up a disk in this
>>manner involves multiple DVDs. That's a lot of work. In the real
>>world this tends to mean that it doesn't get done.
>>
>>* I was going to say _all_ backup programs, but the one I use
>> (Amanda) is a little long in the tooth and still doesn't have
>> this capability. I would think the vast majority of Windows
>> backup programs will do this, however.
>
>
>So you'd go with BUYING an external drive instead?
>
>I don't need a huge one for just the main bones of the OS to back up,
>perhaps 20GB is it right now.
>
>Yours Truly,
>Crackles R. McFarly
>Associates Degree in Air Quality and Pollen Studies
>Certified Air Quality Specialist 'X7 Station: Fulton County, Georgia'

With such modest capacity needs, you might consider using
Compact Flash cards as they're far more immune to the heat,
power, and random mechanical error induced failure points
associated with hard drives. Granted a large % of hard
drives never have a problem but CF is even more reliable.
 >> Stay informed about: Need help to Clone a Drive. As a backup, please help?? 

Norton Ghost is your friend.

"Crackles McFarly" <IrelandSux.TakeThisOut@ireland.sux> wrote in message
news:o0gb93pihsilflmo6ftp5td31ru9glr9u9@bbb.org...
>I have partitioned my drive into two sections. One very large section
> and another much smaller one.
>
> The smallest partition is 3x [three times] the size of the OS and
> every currently on the drive. In other words, the smaller partition is
> more than big enough to accept the data.
>
> Question:
> Can I CLONE the main drive on to the other partition?
>
> It is assigned drive letter Z, so would this work or am I just plain
> crazy?
>
> thanks.
>
 >> Stay informed about: Need help to Clone a Drive. As a backup, please help??